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Richard713

Micro Barbed Hooks

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I'm sure this is a topic that has been visited many times previously, but I've been fishing a few places recently that allow micro barbed hooks to be used.
Previously I've always used barbless hooks but thought I'd give the micro barbed ones a go after reading a few aticles and chatting to people.

Since I've switched to the micro barbed Nash Fang X hooks in a size 7, I've caught two fish and both hook holds were very difficult to remove the hook wheras a barbless I'm sure would have popped out much easier. Also, there was a bit of blood showing around that hook hold where I had to treat the fish with some Gardner Fish Care.

I'm now in two minds as to whether I should switch back to barbless !

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I've had the same experience Richard, I don't like barbed or micro barbed because of this, I don't think that I've ever damaged a fishes mouth or lost a fish using barbless and most of the time the hook comes out when the fish is in the landing net and gets snagged in the netting. There are however reports from a lot of anglers who I listen to on here who think that barbless cause damage.

I don't like the idea of snipping the end off a hook as I think this can cause damage trying to lever on the hook, but then I'm clumsy and as said a lot of anglers who I respect the opinion of (cm included) suggest it's safer.

Me, I'll continue to use barbless, it doesn't make me right, but my experience tells me to use barbless :confused:

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I've used both extensively in my life. Barbless will cause blood same as barbed. Really depends where it hooks. 

I think mouth damage with barbed (micro barbed) is much less when using razor sharp hooks. They sit still. Since fishing the big pits and for harder carp I've used a hook with a barb and had fish Plowe through weedbeds, etc and I hooked them without a bit of damage. 

A razor sharp hook, easily achieveable and popular nowadays on a barbless hook is just like a knife and worse for the fish. 

Barbed hooks shouldn't move in a fish's mouth thus less damage. Unhooked correctly just a slight mark is left. If the fish gets hooked in the side of the mouth damage is more likely due to softer flesh.  Barbed or barbless. 

I have stumbled upon an oddity in the estate lake. My last 20 odd carp caught (and countless bream and tench) since using the multi rig have been bang in the bottom lip. I had 12 from the estate lake on the same rigs and only one was hooked in the bottom lip. All the others were in the side of the mouth, it may have been how they were feeding but I figured out they have a very hard bottom lip. All of them. So the chances are the hook can't catch there and gets them in the side after a bit more movement after picking up the bait. Now mouth damage is inevitable in this case as my hooks are razor sharp and the flesh in the side of the mouth is a lot softer. It's sad but clearly can't be helped. And is likely why a lot of the fish already have mouth damage. I treat any marks with propolis and have seen really good healing capabilities. 

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Get some forceps. Work perfectly on barbed hooks as the biggest problem is trying to get hold of the hook with your fat fingers and thumb around the bend of it.

I am now using micro barbed and have no real problem removing them with a "decent" set of forceps.

 

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46 minutes ago, smufter said:

Get some forceps. Work perfectly on barbed hooks as the biggest problem is trying to get hold of the hook with your fat fingers and thumb around the bend of it.

I am now using micro barbed and have no real problem removing them with a "decent" set of forceps.

 

yes forceps are the tool of choice, but once you know how (plenty of river fishing when younger with barbed hooks on smaller fish) you can pop them out with your fingers. I hold it steady between my index and middle fingers and push the eye of the hook with my thumb, making sure the direction of the hook is lined up so the hook will come out of the fish. Don't wiggle it violently as this will cause unnecessary damage, but a gentle nudge each way to loosen it can sometimes work. 

It's not as easy as it sounds, I use size 4 hooks which mean I have more to hold on to when unhooking, also it means if its easier/quicker I can push through and snip the hook off with some wire cutters, but that's very rare. Most of the time a little room is created during the fight which means you can pop them out quickly. 

Once you become more experienced using them you'll see the benefits and be able to unhook a fish just as quick as a barbless hook. I use them because I'm normally fishing for fish I DO NOT want to lose once hooked. I'm also the type of guy that will get in and swim out to snags/etc if I need to. Even if its just to check the fish has shed the hook and left me snagged up. I have had a few fish shed barbed hooks for whatever reason though (probably me sharpening them dodgy or the point being turned over prior to hooking)

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I think you've got to use some common sense and use appropriate line for the style of fishing your doing so to minimise loosing fishing when using barbed hooks

I don't know about everyone else but I go fishing to catch fish so the slight increase in lip damage is worth it to fish on the bank ratio

the nature of fishing is damaging to a fish both physically and mentally so if it bothers you that much maybe flog up and get some golf clubs

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you are ramming a sharp bit of steel into their mouth, it will bleed with barbed or barbless.

try sticking one into your finger tip, not as difficult as you would think :lol:

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its odd as these are estate lake fish, i'd say 75% of the bottom is silty. So for the mouth to be hard goes against the grain. I think it must be a genetic trait or something. I realised when I tapped a fish's bottom lip and it made the same sound it would if you tapped the operculum! The fish I did nail in the bottom lip were awful to get the hook out. I did need the forceps, it's like they had gone in to bone, something I've never seen before. 

It's a difficult one there as the barbless rule is in effect due to the amount of snags (or management ignorance) but I know my super sharp hooks are basically like a knife in the soft flesh of the mouth, more pressure due to trying to keep them out of snags and it could be a disaster. Luckily it didnt happen as I was wading out to land the fish as they hit the lilies. I did start to feel bad after a few had some damage though.

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I'm using 15lb gardner HD with a 20lb fluorocarbon leader. Was cutting through some stems. These are supercharged lilies though I swear. Took off the leadless leaders as I thought a finer diameter is more likely to cut stems. May revert back in time but until I suffer leader damage,etc. I will stick with this set up. big size 4s help too.

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I honestly don't think that there is a set standard for micro barbs, just the manufacturers thought that the barb is not as big as a standard barb in their range. So how a pattern is classified as micro barb I don't know, especially when the barb on some patterns is quite small anyway.

Mind you, if you ever saw the barb on some Owner FLB's, any other barb is a micro barb.

I think that barbed hooks hold still in the mouth better, and don't saw as much as a barbless during the fight.

 

I do know that Gardner hooks have a micro barb in a number of patterns.

 

Incidentally, like Greekski, I will wade or swim out to snags to check a fish has dumped the hook, and it happens even with barbed that fish can eject it. My thoughts are that a hook works its way in during the fight, it does NOT go barb deep on the pick up, and as has been as far as I'm concerned been proven with lead clips that eject on a take, the lead does NOT cause the hook to dig in or pri ck, it is the tightening or hooking against the rod and fight.

Sounds wrong I know, but a fish does not run because of the hook is in, but because something feels wrong. The tightening against the lead may spook the fish, causing the run, but it does not dig in totally. In fact even barbed hooks can be ejected during the fight, and because of the lead. If a fish does not run, or the lead set-up and line tension is wrong that hook can still be ejected.

 

 

 

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Thanks for the info gents.

Re. hooks setting, for want of a better word, I would have thought a hook must penetrate to some degree when the fish bolts, surely it would spit the hook out every time otherwise?

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9 hours ago, pooter said:

Thanks for the info gents.

Re. hooks setting, for want of a better word, I would have thought a hook must penetrate to some degree when the fish bolts, surely it would spit the hook out every time otherwise?

That's why I always use the line clip on my rods. I'm convinced that the slight "ping" of resistance as the fish first takes off helps "set" the hook.

I've been wrong before though lol!

 

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On hook setting; I use running rigs 90% of my fishing. I've woken up to screamers whilst using the running rig with mega slack lines. Figure that one out. You'd think the hook wasn't in proper on the take due to the slack line. However I think the rig does a lot of the work. 

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4 minutes ago, greekskii said:

On hook setting; I use running rigs 90% of my fishing. I've woken up to screamers whilst using the running rig with mega slack lines. Figure that one out. You'd think the hook wasn't in proper on the take due to the slack line. However I think the rig does a lot of the work. 

I only ever use running rigs, with light leads. Don't think I've ever used more than 1.5 ounces in my life!

:D

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Over the past few years i have specifically only fished waters that allow micro barbs. I know a fish farmer, 2 syndicate owners & most of my angler friends who swear that the small amount of mouth damage is far better than the loss of scales, fin damage, etc. that can be caused upon netting the fish with barbless.

I prefer an inline rig over clips as it reduces the amount of movement from the lead, this has been proven in various dvd's & kordas underwater films. I will use the heaviest lead i can get away with as i believe that is the first point of resistance fortake hook, hence setting the hook. Hence getting screamers on the take.

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Dont get me wrong i dont use cannon balls, but if im using a 8-10 inch hooklink i like the idea of a good anchor point to try & set the hook.

Some of most fruitfull sessions have been with a small 1oz lead the size of a boilie.

Currently on a lake where theres alot of weed so want to get the hook set asap & avoid being snagged up. 

I always buy my ticket but never seem to get my money back, just live in hope that my numbers will come up one day!!!

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